Major Changes Going Forward

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Re: Major Changes Going Forward

#488371

Post by Vince » Tuesday June 09, 2015, 20:20 EDT

Oh! WedgieFiesta. I like it.
Fat guy. 26 years old. Into bigger guys in briefs and wedgies. Asexual/Homoromantic. New Jersey if anyone wants to chat about meet ups in the future. I would love to have buddies but I don't do the slave/master thing.

Have kik now. PM if you want it.

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Re: Major Changes Going Forward

#488372

Post by feeling the aster » Tuesday June 09, 2015, 20:41 EDT

Subtle wrote:
imfeeling22 wrote:Well I'll stop publicly talking about it because I'm sure you guys are sick of it. I'm still pissed but whatever cover your asses but don't give me that crap about how this is protection or anything, lets just call a spade a spade. Its a legal thing nothing more.
Sure. It's a spade. Less wedgies is less fun. I'm with you on that. But nothing you've posted in this thread is a good argument for me and the rest of the staff to play Russian roulette and risk the off-chance of having our lives ruined. Frankly, there weren't a whole ton of pictures and videos getting posted on this site in the first place. This could not possibly have been your go-to place for content.

Might as well just get all the complaints out of the way now. Don't want to hear people griping about this three months from now.

Again, if WedgieHaven is ruined to any of you because these new rules are so stupid, gay, lame, sucks, retarded-ass, or whatever it is you think, feel free to go and set up WedgieZone or WedgieRefuge or WedgieFiesta or whatever the Hell you want to call the super-cool, no-rules rebel wedgie board of your dreams.
I'm fine with that,I get you guys are responsible I don't like it but whatever its not going to change anyway so I'm done. I just don't want to hear any of this crap about protection innocent people because that's just BS.
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Re: Major Changes Going Forward

#488382

Post by DevilishlyUnearthed » Tuesday June 09, 2015, 21:50 EDT

Nopeking wrote:Oh my god. Shut up, 22!
seriously. Just...stop talking 22. You're argument is weak. You can't formulate your thoughts constructively and you gather reasoning like you're 8. Or mentally challenged.

Like...I'm with you on the issue but god stop commenting.

Guys who am I "who carz about laws! who carz about being creepy! who carz if the mods get in trouble?! No one gets in trouble cause of laws!!"
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Re: Major Changes Going Forward

#488384

Post by DevilishlyUnearthed » Tuesday June 09, 2015, 21:57 EDT

I understand the basic policy of "if you dont want to get eaten by sharks dont get in the water"

but....I feel this is a hard line to draw based on the actions of few. Dont get me wrong, I also cringe when I see a wedgie video on the internet and SOME comments are "hot" or "get revenge" or "more please" or "wear briefs'

I understand some one us are not mature enough to realize that...its creepy if you do that. But...again, it IS on the internet on a free and public site, uploaded intentionally for the purpose to be seen.

The "worst case scenerio" would be for 1. someone to link the youtube account to WH a feet that would require a bit of digging on their end. find the link posted on this site which would require further investigation, all initiated by the uploader still. And even then they would to..."take action" by what...calling the cops that their video link is shared on this site? Would they even go to the cops first before asking it to be removed from here?
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Re: Major Changes Going Forward

#488385

Post by feeling the aster » Tuesday June 09, 2015, 22:09 EDT

DevilishlyUnearthed wrote:
Nopeking wrote:Oh my god. Shut up, 22!
seriously. Just...stop talking 22. You're argument is weak. You can't formulate your thoughts constructively and you gather reasoning like you're 8. Or mentally challenged.

Like...I'm with you on the issue but god stop commenting.

Guys who am I "who carz about laws! who carz about being creepy! who carz if the mods get in trouble?! No one gets in trouble cause of laws!!"
Yeah make fun of mentally challenged people that real cool....
You're being creepier than everyone with how much you care about underage stuff being gone.....
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Re: Major Changes Going Forward

#488386

Post by DevilishlyUnearthed » Tuesday June 09, 2015, 22:14 EDT

Subtle wrote:
For those who seem unclear on the liability side of this, please imagine the police showing up at your door to ask why you're an administrator on a fetish site where pictues of minors are swapped and 13 year olds mingle with adults and talk about what gets them off. Please imagine how much you'd enjoy being labeled a sex offender for life when it's some other asshole on here who's trolling for kids, not you.

.
Shutting down the buddy section is...needed, I get that. Raising the age to 18....easy, let's do it.

However. sharing links to videos ...who are not remotely engaged in ANYTHING sexual....holds illegal implications?

It's like, if you liked watching people eat salad...and shared a link of some high schooler eating salad...its just some kid eating salad at the end of the day.
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Re: Major Changes Going Forward

#488400

Post by Captain Hammer » Tuesday June 09, 2015, 22:47 EDT

I'm not entirely sure what you mean by 'I just don't want to hear any of this crap about protection innocent people because that's just BS'; are you implying we don't actually care about the treatment of other people and are using that as an excuse? Because, if so...no, not at all.
The main concern we had that lead to Trek making this decision was the fact that, without the consent of the uploader to feature there stuff, doing so is taking advantage of them. Its not fair to the uploader to have their stuff treated this way without their permission and we can't in good conscience keep doing it, not when all the content was intended to be was a good-natured documentation of a fun moment. We were, quite honestly, more concerned with the uploaders rights than we were about the legal risks involved in hosting the content (to be honest, the legal issues were more brought up to shoot down the 'its not illegal' argument). To put it simply, protecting innocent people's rights from being violated was the entire reason this was decided.


If instead you're meaning that doing this won't do anything to protect them from the creeps, then yeah, fair point. But it means no longer letting them use the site as a means to find new targets; we don't condone their behaviour, so we have to do something to show that. And, yes, it is unfair to 'punish' the many for the actions of the few, but that's how laws and rules are made. One person screws things up, the others get screwed because of it.


And, again, it doesn't matter if the original intention of the content uploader was innocent, once its uploaded onto a fetish site, it does cross into fetish porn. Take, for example, pantsing; pretty similar to wedgies, done a lot as a joke too, and there's a lot of videos of lads and lasses doing it to each other. The police, however, if they found a site where people were getting off to photos and videos of other people's innocent-minded clips and pics, they'd still consider it softcore porn because that's what its being used as. And if its of people of questionable age, they wouldn't question labelling the site a wretched hive of sex offenders.
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Re: Major Changes Going Forward

#488404

Post by DevilishlyUnearthed » Tuesday June 09, 2015, 22:58 EDT

Captain Hammer wrote:We were, quite honestly, more concerned with the uploaders rights than we were about the legal risks involved in hosting the content (to be honest, the legal issues were more brought up to shoot down the 'its not illegal' argument). To put it simply, protecting innocent people's rights from being violated was the entire reason this was decided.

And, again, it doesn't matter if the original intention of the content uploader was innocent, once its uploaded onto a fetish site, it does cross into fetish porn.
So...it sounds like the decision was made by the mods because "it didnt feel right" to have a collection of wedgies vidoes on a wedgie site. Fine.

Also, again its not uploaded here. In any capacity. It's links. Just links. To a vid posted online willingly by the user who (in 2015) should be aware of the repercussions of posting anything online.

I comprehend the desire to...say "clean" the site up a bit (as we age, interest in running or visting 'kink' sites tend to wane i get that) but I would suggest a name change in all honestly if thats the principle motivation behind this. The wedgie site not promoting sharing links to wedgie videos because the uploaders feelings may be uncomfortable for posting a video of them or their friends having their skivvies pulled.

If a Wedgie site doesnt feel its "right" so share (not copy or steal) online wedgie videos, I start to wonder when rhetoric plays a part and the site's name should change to.... i dont know...people-who-hang-out-inaway-with-a-kind-of-interest-in-wedgies haven.
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Re: Major Changes Going Forward

#488408

Post by feeling the aster » Tuesday June 09, 2015, 23:28 EDT

Captain Hammer wrote:I'm not entirely sure what you mean by 'I just don't want to hear any of this crap about protection innocent people because that's just BS'; are you implying we don't actually care about the treatment of other people and are using that as an excuse? Because, if so...no, not at all.
The main concern we had that lead to Trek making this decision was the fact that, without the consent of the uploader to feature there stuff, doing so is taking advantage of them. Its not fair to the uploader to have their stuff treated this way without their permission and we can't in good conscience keep doing it, not when all the content was intended to be was a good-natured documentation of a fun moment. We were, quite honestly, more concerned with the uploaders rights than we were about the legal risks involved in hosting the content (to be honest, the legal issues were more brought up to shoot down the 'its not illegal' argument). To put it simply, protecting innocent people's rights from being violated was the entire reason this was decided.


If instead you're meaning that doing this won't do anything to protect them from the creeps, then yeah, fair point. But it means no longer letting them use the site as a means to find new targets; we don't condone their behaviour, so we have to do something to show that. And, yes, it is unfair to 'punish' the many for the actions of the few, but that's how laws and rules are made. One person screws things up, the others get screwed because of it.


And, again, it doesn't matter if the original intention of the content uploader was innocent, once its uploaded onto a fetish site, it does cross into fetish porn. Take, for example, pantsing; pretty similar to wedgies, done a lot as a joke too, and there's a lot of videos of lads and lasses doing it to each other. The police, however, if they found a site where people were getting off to photos and videos of other people's innocent-minded clips and pics, they'd still consider it softcore porn because that's what its being used as. And if its of people of questionable age, they wouldn't question labelling the site a wretched hive of sex offenders.
I meant a little of both tbh. Thanks for clearing it up tho.
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Re: Major Changes Going Forward

#488413

Post by Briefsforme » Wednesday June 10, 2015, 00:34 EDT

Honestly, we just need to suck it up.

Typically, I hunt for material before I log in wh. Then, I share it if it hasn't been shared already.

So now, we just can't share it. Get over it. lol.

When it comes to new clips and new wedgies, it's kind of whatever because we should all be able to search social media for the newest stuff. If you're too lazy to, wow. haha.

The only part that sucks for me is sometimes someone finds a sleeper wedgie, one that we somehow missed or one that is old.... That's probs the only reason I am still on this site. On the off chance, someone posts something great that I somehow missed or is old. I also like the stories.

For example, I just found an amazing wedgie vid(not on youtube). It's probably one of the best I have ever seen and it probably has never been mentioned, but I can't post it for everyone to see.

That really sucks.... but hey, it's something you should adjust to.

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Re: Major Changes Going Forward

#488414

Post by Captain Hammer » Wednesday June 10, 2015, 00:37 EDT

DevilishlyUnearthed wrote: So...it sounds like the decision was made by the mods because "it didnt feel right" to have a collection of wedgies vidoes on a wedgie site. Fine.

Also, again its not uploaded here. In any capacity. It's links. Just links. To a vid posted online willingly by the user who (in 2015) should be aware of the repercussions of posting anything online.

I comprehend the desire to...say "clean" the site up a bit (as we age, interest in running or visting 'kink' sites tend to wane i get that) but I would suggest a name change in all honestly if thats the principle motivation behind this. The wedgie site not promoting sharing links to wedgie videos because the uploaders feelings may be uncomfortable for posting a video of them or their friends having their skivvies pulled.

If a Wedgie site doesnt feel its "right" so share (not copy or steal) online wedgie videos, I start to wonder when rhetoric plays a part and the site's name should change to.... i dont know...people-who-hang-out-inaway-with-a-kind-of-interest-in-wedgies haven.
Regardless where its hosted, the site is still used as an access point for the content. Its no different than a website that links to where you can watch movies online for free; its still wrong even if you're not the host.
And, no, its not their responsibility to 'be aware of the repercussions of posting anything online'; that's the same line of thinking used for victim blaming. Not everyone is aware of Rule 43; most of these videos originate from social networks, where most users are mostly divorced from 'internet culture', and their understanding of the webs underbelly is 'you can find a lot of porn there', not 'people use your videos for porn'.

And, honestly, I don't see how your rationale for a name change works. We're still a website about wedgies. That's not changed. We might not have as much wedgies in the future as before, but we're still a haven for 'wedgie fans'.
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Re: Major Changes Going Forward

#488420

Post by Collin. » Wednesday June 10, 2015, 02:33 EDT

Just gonna add my 2 cents (or however the saying goes) A haven is a safe place where people are comfortable to speak there mind. Most of our members come to this site at ages 13-15 because they want to know who they are, and what they might want to be apart of. And in regards to social media, they post it, it's there forever whether they want it there or not. That is the golden rule of the basic Internet. What's going on isn't going to prevent anything from happening. It's going to encourage members to branch off and start a new url and/or tumblr just so they can do it. Weren't we discussing how it's wrong to post on anyone's account encouraging and sexualizing a simple prank? This change will most likely increase these occurrences.
This site isn't just for adults, it's also for the youth. I'm not saying I disagree with what's going on, but I don't like how it's being handled
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Re: Major Changes Going Forward

#488467

Post by Mick » Wednesday June 10, 2015, 19:22 EDT

At the end of the day:

a/ the mods are collectively paying for the site
b/ the mods collectively own the site
c/ the mods therefore have the right to collectively decide what they want to do with the site.

Anything beyond that is moot. Their site. Their rules.
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Re: Major Changes Going Forward

#488484

Post by DevilishlyUnearthed » Wednesday June 10, 2015, 19:50 EDT

Captain Hammer wrote:
Regardless where its hosted, the site is still used as an access point for the content. Its no different than a website that links to where you can watch movies online for free; its still wrong even if you're not the host.
http://www.dmlp.org/legal-guide/linking ... -materials

It's right here folks.

Linking is not a crime. It's no where near copyright infringement. It's fair game. Even the definition of copy right doesnt cover the...weird construed interpretation of "I didnt mean for this to be a fetish vid"

http://www.dmlp.org/legal-guide/copyright-infringement

definition of copyright....link above.

Oh wait...I'm posting links...is this copyright since the owners of the source didnt intend to be linked on a wedgie related site? nope. Again, just making sure we are all well informed.
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Re: Major Changes Going Forward

#488515

Post by Captain Hammer » Wednesday June 10, 2015, 20:41 EDT

Yes, merely linking to the photos isn't illegal. Except, that's not all that's done with the photos. They do get reposted here (as many people use the attachment feature or put the URL into the bracket in order to post the image here), as well as saved and re-uploaded elsewhere, and then re-linked. That does cross into infringement.

Note, in the quote you took, I didn't say linking was illegal, I said it was wrong (even the example I used of sites that link to copyrighted video I didn't say that was illegal, as I actually know full well its not, even though it kinda should be). And, as I said earlier, regardless of if its legal or illegal, our concern is how its contributing to people being harassed and that needs to stop, and how we don't have their permission to use their content in the first place for sexually gratification (or whatever you want to say is the reason you enjoy wedgies).


Collin;
We really can't have a site that's for both youths and adults. There's so many different things that both groups need and want, and we can't cater for both, and allowing them to mingle while offering services to both is a terrible idea because it opens youths up to being taken advantage of. As we have no authority to run a service to help youths understand their sexuality (because, really, I'm pretty sure we'd need something official, otherwise we're creepy 20-somethings monitoring youths talk about their sexuality), we had to cut it.
On the 'they'll just find make their own sites and the harassment will be worse' claim, that's not how it works. If they did make their own sites, it'd only serve to waste their time; every attempt to create a 'new' wedgie site previously outside of this and Lucky Fetish has failed because they don't have the time or money to really host the site successfully. Most free domain hosts don't like fetish sites, and if the site starts to get big enough to become noticeable, the domain hosts notice it and shut it down.
The most they can do is use tumblr or twitter, which would really be impractical.
Bottom line is, cutting them from here forces them to find an alternative, and the only alternatives out there are difficult and hamper their ability to benefit from other people's findings.
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